| Pages in topic: < [1 2 3] | Quality of translations (or lack thereof) Thread poster: Sylvain Meyrous (X)
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101translations 
Ireland
Local time: 02:04
Member (2003)
English to Italian
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| Translator ratings would be so useful! | Jul 23, 2008 |
As the general manager of an agency that relies almost exclusively on freelancer, I would really welcome a "blue board of freelancers" where I could learn what proofers really think of other translators' work.
I would like to be able to post a request for review and get 4-5 independent reviewers to give assessments of a translation job (without knowing who did it). Then this could be used in case of a dispute over the quality of a translation.
One of the worst problems ... See more As the general manager of an agency that relies almost exclusively on freelancer, I would really welcome a "blue board of freelancers" where I could learn what proofers really think of other translators' work.
I would like to be able to post a request for review and get 4-5 independent reviewers to give assessments of a translation job (without knowing who did it). Then this could be used in case of a dispute over the quality of a translation.
One of the worst problems that we have with bad translators is that they don't know that they are bad, or that they did a bad job once, and so get very angry when agencies reject their work. Many accuse us of "making up" complaints or bad assessment from our reviewers in order to demand reductions in rates.
If there was a trusted, independent online system for evaluating translations, this would be a wonderful tool - for good translators and for honest agencies. Less so for bad translators and/or unscrupolous agencies!
I know that 101translations would be very happy in helping to fund it.
Are you listening, ProZ?
Giovanni Giusti
101translations ▲ Collapse
| | | | | Quality of translations | Jul 25, 2008 |
I think a very large problem is that people are translating into languages that are not their mother tongue. This is especially true of English because "everybody speaks English" or thinks they do and many of these people are too proud or too arrogant to let a native speaker correct their text. How about "tendencias de un sistema" translated by a native Spanish speaker as "the inclinations of the system"?
| | | | Giles Bickford
United Kingdom
Local time: 02:04
Member (2002)
Spanish to English
| Don't get it right - just get it written | Jul 31, 2008 |
Don't get it right - just get it written - this was a cynical comment by the US humourist James Thurber to explain away the attitude of many gutter press journalists.
My children when younger used to complain that grammar, syntax, punctuation and spelling were unimportant as long as the meaning was clear. I explained that the impression the reader received of the writer went a long way to earning support for the writer's views. If the writig is slap-dash, so probably is the content.... See more Don't get it right - just get it written - this was a cynical comment by the US humourist James Thurber to explain away the attitude of many gutter press journalists.
My children when younger used to complain that grammar, syntax, punctuation and spelling were unimportant as long as the meaning was clear. I explained that the impression the reader received of the writer went a long way to earning support for the writer's views. If the writig is slap-dash, so probably is the content. For me, this applies equally well to advertising copy. My view of the product is often coloured by my view of the marketing department's literacy! If they cannot be bothered to do that properly they are probably just as lax over their quality control. A job applicant who fills up a CV with spelling mistakes will have less of a chance of a first interview than one who bothers to get to right. ▲ Collapse
| | | | Marjory Hord
Mexico
Local time: 19:04
English to Spanish
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| french & spanish too! | Sep 11, 2008 |
Hi, I loved the examples of "seasoned" and "preservatives" because they work the same way in Spanish! (False or partially false cognates) I suffer with my Mexican translation students when they do this type of thing and don't review their work to note that they are saying something that is totally incorrect in Spanish. And Spanish was not my home language (although I grew up bilingual) but I have learned to be careful.
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conejo
United States
Local time: 20:04
Japanese to English
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| It is because of the agency's management philosophy | Jun 4, 2009 |
Definitely, get paid by the hour.
In my opinion, it really depends on the agency's management philosophy.
The main agency I edit for takes care in selecting and reviewing translators to make sure they are good, usually by hiring them for a small to medium-sized job and having their work thoroughly reviewed (and scored, with feedback) by a good editor. This helps avoid getting sub-standard translations to start off with.
They also only hire translators to t... See more Definitely, get paid by the hour.
In my opinion, it really depends on the agency's management philosophy.
The main agency I edit for takes care in selecting and reviewing translators to make sure they are good, usually by hiring them for a small to medium-sized job and having their work thoroughly reviewed (and scored, with feedback) by a good editor. This helps avoid getting sub-standard translations to start off with.
They also only hire translators to translate into their native language, in 95% of cases.
They also pay an appropriate, reasonable rate to translators. They are not trying to hire people for $0.02 per word or anything like that.
They also usually provide an appropriate amount of time to translate jobs.
Given all of the above, as an editor, 95% of the time I see good translation work from them. "Good" work means that there are some occasional errors but they are not egregious, and there are not that many errors. I can 'trust' most of these translators to do a good job. Every now and again I get a translation to edit that makes me go !@#$!@!!!!!. In these cases I make sure to tell the agency about the egregious errors (with detailed feedback), and let them decide how to handle it. Usually if it was horrible they will not use that translator again. Sometimes they will give the translator a warning and use them on one more job (to be again thoroughly reviewed), and give the translator the boot if he/she doesn't measure up at that point.
I think it's all about the agency's system.
Of course, if there is an agency who hires translators to translate into their non-native language, for 50% of the fee that would be reasonable, in 50% of the time that it would take, of course there will be major problems.
If it is too horrible, it might be a good idea to find another agency to work for. Either that, or start charging more, to make it worth your while. ▲ Collapse
| | | | Laurent KRAULAND (X)
France
Local time: 03:04
French to German
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| Very bad source texts... | Jun 4, 2009 |
I can only add one thing to those said above: I have the impression that source texts are written in an increasingly bad way or badly/literally translated by non-natives using e.g. English as a pivot language.
I have no other explanation for horrors such as diseases becoming deceases or créneau becoming Mauerzacken, without any reference to the actual context.
So much for translators being in charge of consistency, accuracy and the like... w... See more I can only add one thing to those said above: I have the impression that source texts are written in an increasingly bad way or badly/literally translated by non-natives using e.g. English as a pivot language.
I have no other explanation for horrors such as diseases becoming deceases or créneau becoming Mauerzacken, without any reference to the actual context.
So much for translators being in charge of consistency, accuracy and the like... when it's mostly a matter of "guesswork" and/or of endless correspondence with the agency to know the real meaning of some words or expressions!
Laurent K.
[Edited at 2009-06-04 08:03 GMT] ▲ Collapse
| | | | | What agencies can do | Jun 4, 2009 |
101translations wrote:
As the general manager of an agency that relies almost exclusively on freelancer, I would really welcome a "blue board of freelancers" where I could learn what proofers really think of other translators' work.
Giovanni, that's in an agency's bag of tricks. Checking the internal mission statement of any translation agency, you'll find two types:
- We buy'em cheap, we sell'em good, we make a bundle.
- We get our clients the most cost-effective value in translation; they pay us to ensure that it is so.
101translations wrote:
One of the worst problems that we have with bad translators is that they don't know that they are bad, or that they did a bad job once, and so get very angry when agencies reject their work. Many accuse us of "making up" complaints or bad assessment from our reviewers in order to demand reductions in rates.
You (and any other outsourcer) can make a difference in the transation market. Never say a translation is bad without showing its "perp" the grounds for your assertion. It won't cost you anything extra... If you had the work fixed or redone, e-mail the "perp" a copy of the final job. If there are any non-disclosure issues involved, they'll have signed a NDA at the outset, so... why not?
Don't enter into an argument on why "six" had to be replaced with "half a dozen". The bottom line is that your client accepted the "new" version, while the "perp's" first one was rejected.
If a significant number of agencies start doing this, the unacceptable translation "perps" will: a) seek more training; b) find ways to develop professionally; or c) cop out, switch to a different profession.
101translations wrote:
If there was a trusted, independent online system for evaluating translations, this would be a wonderful tool - for good translators and for honest agencies. Less so for bad translators and/or unscrupolous agencies!
Organizations like ATA and many others offer that, however translation is subject-specific. A thoroughly certified translator in one subject area may fail miserably in another. Meanwhile, a specialist in this latter area, though sesquilingual, might render a superb job. Think of "The Count of Monte Cristo" and his unfathomed knowledge of anything that began with the letter F (if I recall it correctly). Most translators have it on a few letters, but not the whole alphabet.
Anyway, not all translators - for their own reasons - are willing to get certified by any particular such institution, so you might be missing many good ones.
A good translation agency will gradually develop a list of really good translators for the language pairs and subject areas they need most. Start each translator with a relatively small job. If it comes out bad, bite the bullet, get another translator, until you hit a good one. Take good care of that one, keep him/her happy and well-fed (i.e. busy from your work). Then use this reliable one to assess other candidates, until you two spot another good one. Start growing your list from there. Gradually, your agency's most valuable asset will become a list of thoroughly dependable translators, their language pairs, their specialties, and - surprisingly - their non-specialties!
A sidetracking point here. All agencies ask me about my specialty areas. None so far, including one that seems to do what I'm suggesting here, has asked me about areas I don't translate, ever! Things I tried, and gave up for good. Fortunately, I have a list of colleagues in my pair who are true specialists in these areas. I refer such cases to them immediately. I call this professionalism.
One caveat is not to go overboard trusting CVs nor tests. They are just a starting point.
I once proofread a 250-page book that had been miserably translated. To illustrate, just one of the countless mistakes (not typos, as they were repeated throughout): that translator used "aloud" instead of "allowed" numerous times there: "Nobody was aloud to...". The monoglot publisher told me QUOTE "that translator had a quite impressive CV" UNQUOTE.
One translation test that two different agencies sent me to take has most of its answers on Proz's Kudoz. Some wrong options given there were selected, possibly to mitigate competition.
One translator from another town tried to hire me to take a translation test for him. It's quite simple! Fortunately I could tell them I was too busy at that time.
So, with the present www-globalization, an agency can define a goal of developing a list of translators that will enable it to meet ot exceed its business goals, and maintaining that select team.
Otherwise, what would be the use of a translation agency? If it's just to get lower rates from translators, any end-client can use Proz for a reverse auction.
Good luck!
[]s
Jose
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