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正統中文指南 Style Guide to Authentic Chinese
Thread poster: Kenneth Woo
ysun
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挑語病 Mar 17, 2015

古德明 wrote:

為甚麼他們不像中國人幾千年來那樣,說「殖民地時代之後的發展」、「鄧小平時代之後的十個人」等等?答案就是要做英文的奴才。

既然古先生如此愛挑別人的語病,俺也來挑挑他上面這句話的毛病。他所說的「殖民地時代之後的發展」與「鄧小平時代之後的十個人」,顯然都是現代漢語,「殖民地時代」與「鄧小平」顯然都是現代名詞、現代人名。那麼,中國人怎麼可能說了幾千年呢?因此,他的話很不合乎邏輯。俺並非故意找碴,只是想說明挑別人的語病並不是甚麼太難的事情。因此,他在挑別人語病時應實事求是,也別輕易給人扣上「英文的奴才」等帽子。未經歷過文革的年輕人也許沒見識過大字報是甚麼樣。可以說,古先生的評論文章在風格、語氣等方面与文革期間的大字報如出一轍。

[Edited at 2015-03-17 15:41 GMT]


 
jyuan_us
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我原来提到过有些人无病呻吟 Mar 17, 2015

关于这个POST (後)的计较, 就是一个典型的无病呻吟的例子。

“后XX”已经被作为外来语引入中文,改不了的了, 因此古大师似在做无病呻吟状。

像是“后现代主义”, 已经成为某个专业的固定用法,谁要是想改, 那个圈子里的人准跟他急。


 
wherestip
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一点启发 Mar 17, 2015

http://zh.wikipedia.org/wiki/八十後

70后、80后 等说法,我也是最初在论坛上看到的,当时莫名其妙下在网上搜寻后,觉得又新鲜又不太以为然。 但此时联想一下,何不效法改作 “殖民时期后”、“殖民时期后的发展”、“现代后主义” 等等?

放在前边也好, 但折衷一下换个字,用 “继殖民时代”、“续殖民时代”、“承殖民时期” 之类岂不更符合逻辑 以及汉语的习惯?

然而,若 “后殖民xx” 的说法如大家所说已被普遍接受,则实乃木已成舟矣。 ...


[Edited at 2015-03-17 22:47 GMT]


 
QHE
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Mar 17, 2015

wherestip wrote:

放在前边也好, 但折衷一下换个字,用 “继殖民时代”、“续殖民时代”、“承殖民时期” 之类岂不更符合逻辑 以及汉语的习惯?

然而,若 “后殖民xx” 的说法如大家所说已被普遍接受,则实乃木已成舟矣。 ...


“继殖民时代” 真是言简意赅。是啊,对不少既成事实的差言错语我们也只能“将错就错”了。


 
wherestip
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consistency Mar 17, 2015

QHE wrote:

wherestip wrote:

放在前边也好, 但折衷一下换个字,用 “继殖民时代”、“续殖民时代”、“承殖民时期” 之类岂不更符合逻辑 以及汉语的习惯?

然而,若 “后殖民xx” 的说法如大家所说已被普遍接受,则实乃木已成舟矣。 ...


“继殖民时代” 真是言简意赅。是啊,对不少既成事实的差言错语我们也只能“将错就错”了。



QHE,

谢谢。 俺也是乱出些馊点子而已,想到哪儿说到哪儿。 ...

不过我觉得这种东西还是作到处理一致比较好。 比如说 “post-9/11”, 肯定没人会为追求一致 翻成 “后9/11”(放着现成的 “9/11 后” 不是自己跟自己过不去?)。 “继 9/11” 就没有与 “继殖民xx”等 不一致的问题。


[Edited at 2015-03-17 18:49 GMT]


 
pkchan
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都有人用 Mar 17, 2015

post-9/11 world翻译成中文是什么意思?_百度知道
zhidao.baidu.com › 教育/科学 › 学习帮助
轉為繁體網頁
Jun 26, 2007 - post-9/11 world翻译成中文是什么意思?“911”事件过后的世界其实就是指世界受“911”事件影响发生了格局变化,变化后的世界就是所谓 ...

保家衛國的吸血鬼:《 幕光之城》 小說系列中的後九一一美國 ...
ir.lib.ncu.edu.tw › ... › 英美語文研究所
... See more
post-9/11 world翻译成中文是什么意思?_百度知道
zhidao.baidu.com › 教育/科学 › 学习帮助
轉為繁體網頁
Jun 26, 2007 - post-9/11 world翻译成中文是什么意思?“911”事件过后的世界其实就是指世界受“911”事件影响发生了格局变化,变化后的世界就是所谓 ...

保家衛國的吸血鬼:《 幕光之城》 小說系列中的後九一一美國 ...
ir.lib.ncu.edu.tw › ... › 英美語文研究所 › 博碩士論文 - Translate this page
by 何向蓉 - ‎2014
Oct 15, 2014 - 關鍵詞: 後九一一;國家主義;保護主義;帝國主義;吸血鬼;暮光之城;Post-9/11;nationalism;protectionism;vampires;imperialism;the Twilight series.

戰爭傳播: 一個"傳播者"取向的研究 - Page 285 - Google Books Result
https://books.google.com/books?isbn=9866909646 - 轉為繁體網頁
方鵬程 - 2007 - ‎Mass media and war
北京:解放軍出版社。王菲菲譯(2004)。《權利與恐怖:後 9/11 演講與訪談錄》。台北:商周。(原書 Chomsky,N.〔2003〕.Power and Terror:Post 9/11 Talks and Interviews.

后“9·11”时代美国国家外语能力建设成效及其启示① - 中国外语
www.flcjournal.com/CN/abstract/abstract8664.shtml
轉為繁體網頁
by 文秋芳 - ‎Cited by 3 - ‎Related articles
US National Language Capacity Development in the Post “9·11” Era ... 战略规划和项目集群,概括和总结了后“9·11”时代美国在国家外语能力建设方面取得的成绩。
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ysun
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“post-9/11” Mar 17, 2015

尽管我有点讨厌古德明的作风,但我也觉得“後殖民地時期”、“後鄧小平時代”这种译法不妥。我认为,把 “post-9/11”译为 “后9/11”也不妥。若如法炮制的话,岂非应把 post-graduate student 译为“后毕业学生”,把 post-doctor 译为“后博士”?我认为,对类似的错误译法不该用“约定俗成”的说法予以肯定,而应该说是“积重难返”。

当然,对于以 post- 为前缀的词语,也不能一概而论,而应具体问题具体对待。


[Edited at 2015-03-18 12:49 GMT]


 
ysun
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约定俗成一例 Mar 17, 2015

现在美国人普遍把豆腐称为 Tofu,而不是 bean-curd。这应该可以说是“约定俗成”。类似例子还很多。不过,我们不能因此就给美国人扣上“中文的奴才”这顶帽子。

 
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ysun
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To get a whole picture Mar 23, 2015

David Lin wrote:

In a city where people fear that they might lose the freedom of speech post 1997 in the light of a general worry about poor governance, Tsao appears to be a voice for the many people in various sectors of the society that cover all age range.

Like attracts like. It seems that a lot of people in Hong Kong don’t like Chip Tsao (陶傑). Please read both positive and negative comments about him at this link to get the whole picture:

http://evchk.wikia.com/wiki/陶傑


 
Jinhang Wang
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林纾的“翻译”概念辨正 Mar 23, 2015

我觉得说一个不懂外语的人是翻译家,本身就是不严肃的,违反了“翻译”的定义。翻译是从一种文字到另一种文字的转换,而林纾做的是从中文到中文的修改、润色工作。林纾是与懂外语的人合作才“翻译”出了如此多的作品,他真正精通的是中文。

我觉得林纾对其“翻译”的作品的贡献,最多占 50%(或许还应少些),另50%应该属于哪些懂外语的合作者。


 
ysun
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Most of the articles at the following link are political commentaries Aug 31, 2015


Most of 陶傑's articles at this link that appeared on the first page of this thread are political commentaries. No matter these political commentaries are politically correct or incorrect, they are controversial and would potentially bring about political disputes. Apparently, some people here may like them and tolerate them for some personal reasons, but some other people may not.

As to the style of writing of these political commentaries, I don’t think they should be used as “Style Guide to Authentic Chinese” even if they are not too bad.


 
jyuan_us
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不看林纾也不妨成为好翻译 Aug 31, 2015

Liangdu wrote:

wherestip wrote:

... is too useful for translations from English to Chinese. IMO, the styles of classical Chinese and contemporary English do not mesh at all.


看了林纾也不一定会翻译。没有闲暇看他。

[Edited at 2015-08-31 18:11 GMT]


 
wherestip
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The definition of a translator Aug 31, 2015

jyuan_us wrote:

Liangdu wrote:

wherestip wrote:

... is too useful for translations from English to Chinese. IMO, the styles of classical Chinese and contemporary English do not mesh at all.


看了林纾也不一定会翻译。没有闲暇看他。



jyuan,

I don't think that's even an issue worth discussing. As good as 林纾's classical Chinese may have been, the problem is he didn't even understand any foreign languages.


 
wherestip
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Monolingual talent in classical Chinese Aug 31, 2015

Liangdu wrote:

没看过林纾的人自然会下此种结论。非不为也,是不能也

wherestip wrote:

... is too useful for translations from English to Chinese. IMO, the styles of classical Chinese and contemporary English do not mesh at all.



林纾 could very well have been such a talent. But my point was that classical Chinese(文言文)and contemporary English have very little in common.


 
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